Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Mixed Set Programming Source: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Mixed_Set_Programming

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. The independent source issue is one thing, the other is the fact that much of the article appears to be a copyvio - [1] Black Kite (t) (c) 15:33, 18 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Mixed Set Programming (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log)

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No independent secondary sources to establish notability as required by WP:GNG. A search suggests independent sources may not exist. The only contributors to the article are WP:SPAs. Msnicki (talk) 13:32, 8 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Computing-related deletion discussions. Smerdis of Tlön - killing the human spirit since 2003! 14:26, 8 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment. Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Natural Constraint Language seems to be closely related. - Smerdis of Tlön - killing the human spirit since 2003! 14:32, 8 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Agree, it makes sense to discuss the two together. I think all the comments made so far at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Natural Constraint Language apply to Mixed Set Programming also. Jowa fan (talk) 07:04, 9 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete. I don't see independent coverage. FuFoFuEd (talk) 10:35, 9 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment The page POEM (software) should also be included in this discussion. Jowa fan (talk) 12:15, 9 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for pointing that one out also. I've nominated it for deletion at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/POEM (software). Msnicki (talk) 14:01, 9 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Please do not delete the article "Mixed Set Programming" or merge it into "Natural Constraint Language" because MSP is an even more generic and more abstract scientific concept than NCL. Contributions are welcome. MSP is a very advanced subject to be studied. MSP allows a mathematician to formulate complex problems in a simplified form of mathematical logic (first-order logic, set theoretic reasoning, date/time reasoning, etc.). In this sense, it is a scientific pearl. If so advanced a technology can be applied in industry, it is great. Other words to add are: the concepts of "Mixed Set Programming" and "Natural Constraint Language" are purely scientific concepts, while "POEM" is an industrialized system of the NCL language. Thanks for your understanding. SophiePaul (talk) 16:16, 10 June 2011 (UTC) — SophiePaul (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. [reply]

Of course I understand your enthusiasm, but in an AfD, it's about notability as established by independent secondary sources, not whether this is important material WP:VALINFO or about a new technology that will soon be important WP:ATA#CRYSTAL. That said, you may be able to clear the bar as sources are found. I don't mind changing my WP:!VOTE if that happens. Msnicki (talk) 16:40, 10 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

With some others, I have been trying my best to improve according to your comments. In the page of "POEM", the book of Li is about logistics optimization modules developed using POEM. In the page of "Natural Constraint Language", the 3rd and 4th (independent) related works cite Dr Zhou's work and they target similar objectives. MSP is extremely complex and the research work on it is terribly hard. It involves techniques in different fields: operations research (combinatorial optimization/complexity theory/algorithm), logic programming (first-order logic/numerical reasoning/naive set theory), ... SophiePaul (talk) 10:30, 14 June 2011 (UTC) — SophiePaul (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. [reply]

• Delete Poorly written article about apparently non-notable academic work. —Ruud 20:08, 12 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
• Please do not delete I think Wikipedia's requirements for these articles have been met. I have followed the above advices to do necessary improvement by adding secondary sources found by Google search. If anything else still need to be done, please let me know. SophiePaul (talk) 10:30, 14 June 2011 (UTC) — SophiePaul (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. [reply]
• Keep. Sources have been added since the article was listed. Jowa fan (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 13:19, 14 June 2011 (UTC).[reply]
  • And which of those are the significant independent coverage? FuFoFuEd (talk) 07:37, 15 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
    • I haven't looked into this in detail. There's enough common ground between this and NCL that I don't feel the need to go through the same process again. I suspect that this group of articles will stand or fall together. Jowa fan (talk) 08:24, 15 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment Papers in a journal of which I can't even verify if it exists or not... —Ruud 16:35, 15 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
    • If you're referring to China Journal of Enterprise Operations Research papers, I suspect it doesn't matter because the authors of those papers appear to be part of the same group or company promoting/developing POEM/NCL/MSP. See [2] for example where H. Ni is a coauthor. FuFoFuEd (talk) 18:08, 15 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep After reading SophiePaul's comments, I think this article is notable. Petterclp (talk) 06:01, 16 June 2011 (UTC) — Petterclp (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. [reply]
• Keep SophiePaul's comments and arguments are reasonable. But please improve. Logicfan (talk) 07:25, 16 June 2011 (UTC) — Logicfan (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. [reply]
• Another argument for the lack of notability of NCL/POEM/MSP is that there's no mention of any of J. Zhou's work in the comprehensive Handbook of constraint programming (2006). FuFoFuEd (talk) 11:09, 16 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep. Of course, this article needs to be improved. Dr Zhou has published a book and the article can be certainly further developed. My arguments:
  • After reading some of Zhou's papers, I believe MSP is a very interesting algorithmic framework.
  • Elegant mathematical logic (e.g., quantifier logic and set theory) is applied in solving problems as difficult as set partitioning and VRP.
  • MSP is no doubt notable. Ortech123 (talk) 06:35, 17 June 2011 (UTC) — Ortech123 (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. [reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.